Update: 3rd Dec Thanks to Serban for the full high quality video.
Thanks to everyone who has sent me the transcript, Susan, The ODI, Caroline, YaGotSomeArztOnYa and anyone else I may have missed, also BJ for the initial heads up and to my good friend Susan who has once again spent a lot of time to video the Mobisode from her phone. Again the quality is not very good but it's better than nothing. Of course when ABC release the full quality version I will post that here is well next week.
Note: I've started to post all the Lost Mobisodes in the Lost Trailers section as well.
Lost Mobisode 4 - Missing Pieces - The Deal
(Comments: 80)
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80 Comments:
Were these filmed recently or last year? I only ask because Michael left in season 2 and Juliet didn't sign on to Lost until he was gone, so essentially it would have been impossible to have them together unless these mobisodes were filmed recently.
Dark... episode 2.. are you sure ;)
And I thought Verizon was releasing them on Tuesday, not Monday,, odd, hopefully someone can get it to you soon.
wouldnt this be mobisode 4 rather than 2?
Ash: they were filming them at the same time as season 4.
Bet it's to do with the boat.
I think is when they were planning for Michael to go and set the trap for capturing Jack, Kate and Sawyer! Lets remember that in episode EXPOSE Paulo listens to a conversation between Ben and Juliet
The last thing Mike says to Mrs Klugh before being freed is
"...And I want the boat!"
I bet this scene will be the follow up to that. They send Juliet in as the negotiator.
michael is sitting tied up in the hut.. juliet walks in
J: Hello michael.. juliet
M: What do you want?
J: The boat you asked for.. they asked me to tell you it's yours
M: Good
J: Beatrice told me you saw your son.... i spent some time with him.. with walt... he's a very interesting kid.. very smart...very special.
M: What do you mean special?
J: Well he's not an ordinary boy, which is why i'm worried about him. Thats why i'm very glad you agreed to do this for us.. i'm glad that you're going to get him away from here.
M: You expect me to believe you give a damn about my son?!
J: Believe it or not michael, i am not your enemy.
M: Oh you're not huh?!
J: No, i'm not....... the man in your camp, the one you're going to free. His name is ben..he's very important.
M: Is he the one who can get me off this island?
J:YES
M:Will he?
J: YES, HE WILL
M: And i guess i'm just supposed to take your word for it?
J: I guess you are......... i made a deal with him too.
M: Then why are you still here?
J: Because he saved my sisters life..
M: And where is she?
J: Miami
M:But you had to stay?......whats the point of saving her if you can't even be with her?
J:Wouldn't you do anything, to save walt?........ you have your list....good luck.
juliet walks out and michael struggles to free himself... end of scene.... kick ass mobisode.. they're definately getting better!
ooohhhh...I was right about the boat!!!
I like continuity :)
Only thing is...
I liked it when Michael was on the pier at the end of season 2 and saw "Henry gale" arrive. His expression of shock when he realises the man he freed from the hatch was infact their leader is priceless.
Now that we've found out Michael new he was in charge (ie the "one who can get him off the island") it kinda ruins that scene a little bit...
:(
thanks for the transcript..!!
sounds sweet..!!
Coincidence that the length is 3 minutes, and Three Minutes is the name of the episode's flashback in which the events would have occured? I think not!
This is intresting!!! I wonder if Ben plan for him to get capture in order to bring jack sawyer and kate! Pluse it looks to me that juliet is the right hand of Ben, not only as a leader but as an apprentice for mind games!!! Just one question, is Juliet dress as savage???
Thanks
The one thing i've never understood about the whole Kate, Jack, Sawyer and Others thing is:
- What was the main purpose of all that?
Jack: "So uh... if you really can get off the island, why didn't you just take him to a facility? Why all this?"
Tom: "Because ever since the sky turned purple..."
THE THING IS! Before the purple sky, Jack was already kidnapped, BEFORE! There is something we don't know about all that part of the season, and don't tell me it's because Ethan was the only surgeon, they could get off the island!
And why only Jack and Kate had band-aids??? These two questions are stuck in my head for a long time! Maybe the mobisodes will have something to do with all this.
yes juliet is dressed all haggard looking like season 2 others
cool mobisode! its nice to see michael again :)
i found it interesting when juliet told michael that walt was special thats why she's glad that he's going to get him away from the island!
its like walt has to get off the island!!!
breakaleg- I think Ben simply did not want to leave the island, he refused to. I think the goal of kidnapping the three of them was twofold- 1) Get Jack to do the surgery and use Kate and Sawyer to manipulate him, 2) Get Kate and Sawyer to have sex so they have another pregnant woman to experiment on.
Honestly, I wasn't a fan of this mobisode, Juliet was always too stiff for me. Why would Michael ask why she wouldn't be with her sister? Is anybody really that close to their siblings?
The one thing I did like is that they brought up Walt, and that he's special, the producers always said they would get back to that, and I bet they will make it important this season.
I liked this mobisode very much; now we do have two valuable mobisodes on hand: the previous one and this one! I think the very first mobisode was to introduce how the rest of the mobisodes are gonna be, like an advertisement but also the "part" of the mobisodes. But these "Walt is special" conversations always driving me crazy - why don't they just tease a little bit about that issue? Walt is special... WHY? Just an only clue, but not the appearing in the middle of the jungle as wet and whispering backwards, we know that of course. :P
BTW, petor23, you have a great point: the mobisode is three minutes long, which is also related to that episode "Three Minutes". I can only think about that the producers/writers have planned it so that we could dig it up. :D
Wow. Again, I'm more and more impressed by what missing pieces they are showing us. This was yet another thing that rattled around in my head after the season two finale.
They had Michael for some time, was his encounter with Klugh the only real one prior to the big send off of Libby and Ana Lucia? No, guess not.
And after re-watching seasons one and two in prep for season three on dvd, I've noticed a dozen or more little pieces I'd like to see . . .
I'd also forgotten how desperate season two was in contrast to three - it seems like that whole season was about confinement. Even this missing piece.
I'm still hoping that some way or another we can download or buy all of them collected after the run is finished.
Thanks for clarifying it, Hipster Doofus. Those are reasonable explanations for my questions. But it still leaves the band-aids, why Jack and Kate? Blood samples? Why Sawyer didn't have one? Maybe some experiment was done to them!
And this mobisode is my favorite, along with the 3rd. MY SON! Geez, there goes Michael again...
Oh... this is sweet! And seeing Harold again ist just great...
Speaking of missing pieces... anybody remember "The Other 48 days"? When they found the Arrow, they found the trunk with the bible in it and a glass eye... now, when I watched that episode a few days ago, the first person I thought of was MIkhail... could it be his eye? Would that mean he took the glass eye out because the island started closing his wound? Hm...
I don't know about the band-aids...
I'm pretty sure the episode was titled "Three Minutes" because that's how long Michael had w/ Walt.
Cool Mobisode! The best one so far is 3rd, but this one is good too. Love seeing characters interact that normally never do. And I love anything with Juliet!
Thanks for uploading!
breakaleg they took sawyer's blood too but we just saw that on promo pic
http://gallery.lost-media.com/albums/ep-promos/sea3/cities/normal_2citiespromo-12.jpg
I'm kinda sick of hearing that Walt is "special" too. I want to know why he's so special to some people but to Brian Porter he's "different". Brian was also very afraid of him. And it appears that the Others thought Walt was too much to handle. I do hope all of this is addressed in S4.
Oh yeah! Thank you lyly, you're right, they took Sawyer's blood too. Phew... minus two mysteries to worry about :P!
Why would Michael ask why she wouldn't be with her sister? Is anybody really that close to their siblings?
I think that was to leave the door open for Juliet to basically tell Michael to use any means possible to free Ben and bring back the people on the list. "Wouldn't you do ANYTHING for your son Micheal?" Those words were probably going through his head while he was holding the gun and deciding whether or not to kill Ana Lucia.
Another fun mobisode. I've loved them all so far. I love creepy, manipulative Juliet. I'm not a big Michael fan, but I'll be glad to see that loose end tied up.
I loved this one! Great to see those two interacting a little bit :)
PS: where is the full quality version of the third mobisode...? It seems that someone at abc.com forgot to do his job this week!
Thanks so much to Susan and Dark for my weekly Lost fix!
It was so good to see Juliet. Interesting pairing, Juliet and Michael. Not quite as good as last week with Ben, but way better than the first 2 weeks.
These mobisodes are getting better and better! I loved this one too! And thanks for the transcript! For us non-native speakers it's essential!!
It is full of hints! When Juliet says: "That’s why I’m very glad that you agreed to do this for us. I’m glad that you’re going to get him away from here" OMG! Is she referring to the 'real' enemies? So were the others actually protecting them when they took them away?
This is a real missing piece (the fact that they kidnapped the children) but I still can't quite accept the fact that nobody questioned Juliet about anything back at the camp...ok, jack was protecting her but still...not even a single question! Juliet knows about everything...she's not the enemy... so did she know about the freighter? OMG!
I love manipulative Juliet, but I was really hoping for more from these mobisodes than we're getting. That said, this was the best so far IMHO.
Somewhat OT, I find it painful to watch Juliet in this. I recently re-watched the movie "Frequency" (Denis Quaid) from 2000 and lo and behold, there was Elizabeth Mitchel (co-starring) in her pre-botox days. What a wonderful expressive face she had! It's a real shame she decided to trade that for a wrinkle-free forehead.
Like the 3 the previous mobisodes it showed a frustrated expectation (Jack's marriage, Hurley's encounter with Libby, Jack leaving the island in the sub, Michael leaving the island with Walt - as we know from the spoilers that he will be back).
Nice to see an interaction that we have never seen before, but I liked the previous one better.
@methosrocks Totally agree. I guess that's why she has to express herself so much with her eyebrows...
Thanks Susan and Dark.
I really like this one (and the Ben/Jack was very good too).
Every mobisode is better than the previous (in my opinion) , this is good. And I've missed Michael, nice to see him again.
Can't wait to see Locke or Sawyer.
And I hope to have any chance to see Mikhail or Richard in a mobisode, but I think it's difficult.
Awful acting, awful writing, each one of these mobisodes have been terrible.
JULIET!!!!!!!!
I think i just had my Elizabeth Mitchell fix to last me all the way until the first episode!
I didn't know she looked different in her previous movies! So you think her patronizing I-am-sooo-sorry-I-want-to-cry look comes from a faulty botox injection...it could be!
I like the character a lot, I think she's intruiguing, her FBs have always been interesting and well written but as for the actress I've never been able to judge her! I don't know if it's the botox or if she wants to force this fake expression on her face to show that Juliet is lying and manipulative, but if she isn't, then her puppy eyes get on my nerves!!
@methocrocks - I find it painful to watch Juliet in this. I recently re-watched the movie "Frequency" (Denis Quaid) from 2000 and lo and behold, there was Elizabeth Mitchel (co-starring) in her pre-botox days. What a wonderful expressive face she had! It's a real shame she decided to trade that for a wrinkle-free forehead.
Check out the last Media Mentions entry. Elizabeth Mitchell still has an expressive face. Her character requires her to have that deadpan face.
@jacob's chair - Can't wait to see Locke or Sawyer.
Amen to that brotha (or sista, whatever the case may be).
Check out the last Media Mentions entry. Elizabeth Mitchell still has an expressive face. Her character requires her to have that deadpan face. - saska
Yeah, I think so too. I mean, she always has an expressive face in her interviews. It's just a shame that she has to use this acting device all the time because it makes her look much older than she really is but I have to admit that it fits the role. Juliet is a character that has been trapped on the island for over 3 years now and the only way for her to survive in that place was to turn into a cold woman who shows no emotions anymore. One could say that deadpan look on her face is like a shield that protects her emotions so that no one gets to see them. The character seemed to open up in the season finale and I hope the trend continues throughout season 4 so that the actress finally gets a chance to show her whole arsenal.
I recently re-watched the movie "Frequency" (Denis Quaid) from 2000 and lo and behold, there was Elizabeth Mitchel (co-starring) in her pre-botox days. What a wonderful expressive face she had! It's a real shame she decided to trade that for a wrinkle-free forehead. - methosrocks
A wrinkle-free forehead? I can't believe that I'm discussing this kind of stuff right now but if you really take a look at Elizabeth in interviews you can see that she has small crinkles around her eyes when she laughs. I think that's quite endearing.
Awesome. The mobisodes are getting better and better.
This is the first time we've seen Michael since season 2 and I didn't look at the description so when the video started I jumped from my seat.
=====================
We in Norway got the DVD box for season 3 in October and in the 'Exposè'-commentary Kitsis and Horowitz say something like they hope for more 'exposè'-episodes in the future. I think they might've referred to the mobisodes since they are much like 'Exposè' flashbacks (moments that happened off-screen we don't know anything about).
We don't learn anything that we don't already know... Except for Klugh's full name (which doesn't matter because she's dead -.-).
@precious - Juliet is a character that has been trapped on the island for over 3 years now and the only way for her to survive in that place was to turn into a cold woman who shows no emotions anymore.
True. Her sister Rachel brings out her emotional side. Otherwise, she pretty much suppresses her feelings. She does seem to feel empathy for Jack, though.
Best. Mobisode. Ever.
The scene reinforces the lengths Michael would go to to free his son. This is just setting up Michael's redemption for killing AL & L.
By FAR the best one yet
I think the point of this mobisode is to show us the kind of person Michael really is. When Juliet explains her deal with Ben, Michael can't understand her altruism. When he says "What's the point of saving her if you can't even be with her?" it really just shows what a selfish man he is; all he thinks of is himself. Throughout his FBs, his ex- and her lawyers have hinted at this (though I never personally saw any evidence that he was being anything but a concerned father...until now). Now, this missing piece gives us a glimpse of the way he thinks; it almost hints that Michael would not try to save Walt at all if it meant they couldn't be together. It's driven home even more when Juliet asks him, "Wouldn't you do ANYTHING to save Walt?" and he DOESN'T REPLY; he just looks away uncomfortably, as if he's thinking, 'No, not if it meant losing him.' In any case, I liked it. I've been wondering what the heck was so wrong with Michael that Susan wouldn't marry him or let him near his child, and this gives me hope that Season 4 will shed some more light on this.
This is definitely the best one yet. I think they put those first two first so that the mobisodes would build momentum in our eyes, rather than putting "lame ones" later in the series.
I think the mystery solved here is why Michael took the Others on their word that if they did what they asked, they would give him the boat: Juliet is a testimony that they delivered on a promise.
Of course, that doesn't mean the boat is all it was cracked up to be... it got him off the Island, as promised, but we don't really know that it got him *home*, which as I remember the dialogue, was never specifically promised. It's possible the coordinates he followed led him straight to the Looking Glass, or something like it. Or maybe the Freighter.
interesting take autumnatic. I'm a fan of Michael, so I don't want to believe that he's just selfish, but if that is true, then when he gets a chance for redemption, then it will be that much more satisfying.
...it really just shows what a selfish man he is; all he thinks of is himself.
I agree. Michael's story is one of selfishness. That's why introducing him to Walt was so important to making him interesting. He had to try to pull his focus off his own life to protect and serve Walt. He obviously went too far, committing double homicide, but I think autumnatic is exactly correct in the thrust of this mobisode.
Michael's journey is that of the selfish man who must change his character. I think we will see Michael 180 degrees different from this when we are reintroduced to the character. He'll be a calm man, less ruled by his passions, with a clearly defined purpose. He may even reappear as ostenbibly a member of the Bad Guys, either on the Freighter or in a FF.
Btw, I think this mobisode was recently filmed. Perrineau looks a bit older than Season 2.
Anyone else think they should put these on the season 4 DVD when they release it next year?
It would be helpfull for people who don't have access for them online.
Also fun to re-watch, whenever. on a TV, and not a cell phone.
I'm not a big fan of
Michael and I think this exchange with Juliet tells us a great deal about the contrast in their characers. Juliet will sacrifice herself and her happiness for her sister's life. Michael, on the other hand, asks what the point of saving a loved one is if you can't be with them. WTF? Reminds me once again that I wouldn't want to be in a "fox hole" and depending upon Michael. That is such a selfish thing for anyone to say, much less a father. It is astonishing to me that it is Juliet who has to address the issue of doing whatever you must to save the life of someone you love, even if it means sacrificing your personal happiness.
Thanks, bong and hipster. I can't say I've ever been a big Michael fan, though I wanted to be (something about Harold Perrineau in general just annoys the heck out of me, and I couldn't help thinking when I saw him on LOST that he was cast for this intangibly annoying quality). But throughout this whole time, I never could understand what was so wrong, what was so horrible about the man just wanting to be with and love his child. I never saw the selfishness the writers tried to paint in his FBs; in fact, I've always thought Susan was the selfish, horrible one. I've been itching for a deeper look at what exactly made Susan turn on him (or set him up), and if the writers can flip his situation and make me like that woman (who is even MORE annoying to me, with her simpering be-nice-to-me,-my-eyes-are-big pitifulness) over Michael, then they are truly the greatest writers of all time and we should all bow down to them.
this reply is for breakaleg;
THE THING IS! Before the purple sky, Jack was already kidnapped, BEFORE! There is something we don't know about all that part of the season, and don't tell me it's because Ethan was the only surgeon, they could get off the island!
Jack, Sawyer, Kate and Hurley were captured just before the purple sky event. They were taken directly to the Pala Ferry dock where they saw Michael and Walt and then Hurley was let go to tell the rest of the Losties what happened. There's nothing more to tell about that part unless you want to see how they were carried from the clearing from where they were drugged.
I am so happy to see this! I love Juliet and I must say that I think that this mobisode is a big improvement over the previous ones.
I wonder if this clip isn't supposed to make us think that it was actually Juliet who added Jack's name to the list (remember he wasn't "on Jacob's list"). She may have added it under the guise of using him for Ben's surgery, but maybe her real motive was her personal hope of making a connection with him so that she would have an ali on the island. (She certainly seemed impressed with him in Expose when she and Ben were watching him via the pearl). I doubt that she would want Jack to know that she played a bigger part in his kidnapping then he is aware of.
I still think that she is a wolf in sheep's clothing (which is what I suspect tptb really want us to think). Love her though!
Now if we could just have a mobisode Sawyer! I love to see some of the missing converstaion between he and Kate. Like his playing the tape recorder for her as Sayid directed, or his explaination about Ben the bunny killer, or his pacemaker, etc. Of course another scene with Sayid and Sawyer would be just as welcome!
are these mobisodes filmed now or were filmed then? Cause if its are missing pieces could be filmed for those episodes and not now. I had been comparing Michael's hair and beard and he had the same lenght in both, episode and mobisode.
Mmmm...more questions and no answers.
are these mobisodes filmed now or were filmed then?
Hi Venus,
It's my understanding that these are all newly filmed.
DRM said: Michael, on the other hand, asks what the point of saving a loved one is if you can't be with them. WTF? Reminds me once again that I wouldn't want to be in a "fox hole" and depending upon Michael. That is such a selfish thing for anyone to say, much less a father.
Exactly, DRM and autumnatic. Michael plays the parent card whenever he can, but his statement suggests that he really doesn't get it at all. It makes the murders even more reprehensible to me.
In his flashbacks he seemed the opposite - that in the end he willingly let Walt go seemingly for Walt's best interest.
southernbeauty - fyi, "Jacob's list" and the list Klugh gave Michael of the four were different lists. I forget where that was explained, but the kidnapping was for the ultimate end of getting Jack to do Ben's surgery, which was hinted at in Expose with Ben's and Juliet's overheard conversation.
But why didn't Ben just leave the island for outside doctors? I think he has a self-imagined bond with the island (like Locke does) and probably feared what would happen to him if he left.
Thanks, Dark.
And about the last one, I think the main purpose for kidnapping Kate, Sawyer and Jack was the pregnancy matter not the surgery ( as Alpert said in The brig, this is Ben's priority)
We may find out that breeding was another purpose for capturing K/S/J but Ben's tumor was probably more important to Ben at the time. If we believe what we are shown on screen, the surgery was the purpose of their caputure. From Expose:
Juliet - That him? Shephard?
Ben - Yes.
Juliet - He's cute. Why are we doing this? Shephard will never agree to do the surgery.
Ben - No, I can convince him to do it.
Juliet - How?
Ben - Same way I get anybody to do anything. I find out what he's emotionally invested in...and I exploit it.
Juliet - So, what, we just grab all 3 of them...Ford and Austen too.
Ben - No, they need to come to us.
Juliet - And how do we make that happen?
Ben - Michael of course.
smaug86 said...
Jack, Sawyer, Kate and Hurley were captured just before the purple sky event. They were taken directly to the Pala Ferry dock where they saw Michael and Walt and then Hurley was let go to tell the rest of the Losties what happened.
What he is saying, I think, is that Jack was captured BEFORE any of that happened, and they let him go. That is, in the scene when Tom/Mr. Friendly has the back and forth with Jack, they light up the torches, and then set Jack & company free to go back to camp.
If Ben needed a surgeon, and the surgeon "fell out of the sky", why didn't he just snatch Jack at that point, instead of going through the elaborate plot to trick Michael into running off into the jungle, kidnapping him, forcing him to lure Jack into camp and having to pay him back by letting him leave the island by boat? Why release Jack and then go through all that to get him back?
I have a feeling there is a good answer to this question, but I don't know what it is and on the surface it makes no sense.
weezil you are right, I just forgot this dialogue.
Anyway I can't understand why Ben needs Jack when they can get a good doctor outside as they did with Juliet.
I think that they've already talked about that in an interview?
And I think that the answer was: because in other case they would't have that plot ( kidnap,...).
Maybe Jacob ordered Ben to catch them and Ben is just lying to Juliet about the kidnapping purpose, as he uses to do. It is obvious that Jack did the surgery but all we know is that maybe here is something more...I think that Sawyer and Kate were important to Jacob, Picket said that Jack isn't on the Jacob list, this could mean that Sawyer and Kate are on the list. (I know -that Mikhail said that Kate wasn't on the list but he is a liar as Ben is)
There was this dialogue in the "Special" episode that at the moment I found just funny:
MICHAEL [exiting]: Walt! Walt!
HURLEY: He seems to hate it, doesn't he?
JACK: What?
HURLEY: Being a dad.
JACK: No, it's just a lot of hard work.
...
HURLEY: No. He hates it.
But perhaps Hurley was right...
Good point 3D. I just don't understand why the Others didn't take Jack, Kate and Sawyer when they had the chance in The Hunting Party. Maybe because Locke was present? I don't know, but that seems like a plot hole to me.
And venus, regarding your question: Why the Others would go by all the trouble it means trick somebody to come to the island when they have a spinal surgeon already there? It's far more easy kidnap Jack than bring somebody from the "real world".
And about Ben not going outside the island to remove his tumor I agree with what has been said here: Ben don't want to go out the island because of his kinda weird "connection with the island", very much in the same fashion as Locke.
Hope my english is good. XD
Personally, I don't believe there is a "Jacob's List" anywhere but in Ben's mind. It's part of the ruse to keep his people under control.
Juliet isn't a surgeon and wasn't capable of performing such a delicate surgery.
In my opinion, the running "theme" seems to be free will and Ben needed Kate and Sawyer as bait to make Jack WANT to do the surgery of his own free will, which we all know Jack saw right through, didn't do the surgery based on free will, but based on a strategy to free his friends which is why Ben was having such a difficult time recovering. The island wasn't helping him recover because Jack was more or less forced to do something he didn't want to do.
The "free will" issue is most likely the same reason Locke didn't shoot Jack and why he can't just tell Jack why they aren't supposed to leave. The island wants Jack so Locke can't kill him, but Jack has to want to stay, he has to come to that conclusion on his own.
JMO
katieb20022001 said...
In my opinion, the running "theme" seems to be free will and Ben needed Kate and Sawyer as bait to make Jack WANT to do the surgery of his own free will, which we all know Jack saw right through, didn't do the surgery based on free will, but based on a strategy to free his friends which is why Ben was having such a difficult time recovering.
OK. I agree with the above, but it doesn't address the other seeming plot hole. Luring Jack to the camp via Michael is the exact same thing as capturing him and bringing him to Ben to do the surgery in "The Hunting Party", vis a vis free will. Either way, he has to be brought in against his will and then coerced to do the surgery -- somehow.
So we come back to the same problem: why didn't they just snatch the same three people in "The Hunting Party" instead of releasing them and going through an elaborate scheme to recapture them?
I think the answer may be that they had not thought of the tumor storyline, or even the Ben character at all, at the point of "The Hunting Party". Which is OK, and I'm not picking on the writers who have managed to construct an amazing tapestry of characters and mythology with very few slipups, but this appears to be one. And, I'd be fine with it if they come up with a reasonable explanation for it, and they still might.
The island wasn't helping him recover because Jack was more or less forced to do something he didn't want to do.
I don't know... it seemed like he recovered pretty quickly once the surgery was over. He was up on his feet well before the season finale, which was, in show time, about 2 weeks after the surgery.
I could see the argument that the Island was displeased with him and that's why it didn't heal the tumor in the first place -- this was even pretty much said outright by Ben to Locke, in the episode where Locke blew up the sub. But once the surgery took place it looked like a normal recovery to me.
Yeah guys... this is starting to seem like a plot hole to me. That's what i meant: they intended to kidnap Jack before the purple sky, they could bring someone else or Ben could leave the island. So when Tom said: "Since the sky became purple..." i was like: wth, they kidnapped Jack before! I wonder if we are ever gonna get an explanation for that. Thanks for discussing this!
So we come back to the same problem: why didn't they just snatch the same three people in "The Hunting Party" instead of releasing them and going through an elaborate scheme to recapture them?
Maybe because Locke was with them and they didn't want Locke and maybe because by getting Michael to lure them into a trap they would be able to shoot them with the darts and render them unconscious, making them much easier to take back to their camp. Could you imagine trying to force a conscious Jack, Sawyer and Kate to go anywhere with you for very long?
I don't know... it seemed like he recovered pretty quickly once the surgery was over. He was up on his feet well before the season finale, which was, in show time, about 2 weeks after the surgery.
Conversation between Ben and Locke that seems to indicate that Ben isn't healing as quickly as he should.
BEN: Was it immediate? It started the moment you got here?
LOCKE: Yeah.
BEN: And you were just walking? The feeling returned right after the crash? That day?
LOCKE: That's what immediate means Ben. You’re wondering why it hasn't happened for you. You're not recovering as fast as you'd like. How long has it been since Jack fixed you? A week? Now that I think about it, how'd you get sick in the first place?
That's what i meant: they intended to kidnap Jack before the purple sky, they could bring someone else or Ben could leave the island. So when Tom said: "Since the sky became purple..." i was like: wth, they kidnapped Jack before! I wonder if we are ever gonna get an explanation for that.
Perhaps the initial plan was for Jack to travel with Ben and a couple of his cronies off the island to a facility where Jack could remove the tumor and then Ben would come back and who knows if he would've let Jack stay or live afterward, he obviously had connections in the real world. But, when the sky turned purple their communications went down so Ben would not be able to find his way back to the island if he left so they made do with what they had. Would Ben really have chosen to have such a critical operation in a such a primitive environment if he had a choice? I doubt it and I doubt the line from Tom was an oversight, the writers are too smart for that. I do remember someone asking Gregg Nations about it and he answered with something like "Hmm....why indeed?"
nestor said:"And venus, regarding your question: Why the Others would go by all the trouble it means trick somebody to come to the island when they have a spinal surgeon already there? It's far more easy kidnap Jack than bring somebody from the "real world".
I don't think so, I think is easier to bring someone as they did with Juliet than force a kidnapped surgeon who had seen them torturing, kidnapping and killing his people. The thing is that Ben nearly dead in Jack's hands. Is Ben stupid? or maybe the real purpose of the kidnapping was another
Sorry if my english is not good.
katieb20022001 said...
Maybe because Locke was with them and they didn't want Locke and maybe because by getting Michael to lure them into a trap they would be able to shoot them with the darts and render them unconscious, making them much easier to take back to their camp. Could you imagine trying to force a conscious Jack, Sawyer and Kate to go anywhere with you for very long?
Actually yeah, I could imagine it, if I had them surrounded by 40 people with guns.
I think the real reason is they didn't write the tumor storyline until 2 years later. And like I said, I'm not even criticizing them for that... just come up with a way to explain it ex post facto and I would be fine with it.
Perhaps the initial plan was for Jack to travel with Ben and a couple of his cronies off the island to a facility where Jack could remove the tumor and then Ben would come back and who knows if he would've let Jack stay or live afterward, he obviously had connections in the real world. But, when the sky turned purple their communications went down so Ben would not be able to find his way back to the island if he left so they made do with what they had.
If Ben could leave the Island to have the surgery in an equipped facility with Jack, why would he need Jack? Why be so happy that a spinal surgeon fell out of the sky? Just go to a hospital with an on-site spinal surgeon.
The reason Jack is important is because he appeared where Ben is. The whole storyline is contingent on the idea that Ben can't leave the Island -- for some as-yet undisclosed reason -- so he needs Jack to do it, in the crappy facility that they have.
Would Ben really have chosen to have such a critical operation in a such a primitive environment if he had a choice? I doubt it and I doubt the line from Tom was an oversight, the writers are too smart for that.
I think the line from Tom about the purple sky was meant to be the overarching reason why they couldn't take Ben off the Island, but when they wrote it they forgot that Ben already had Jack captured (when he supposedly already knew about the tumor) and let him go, in Season 1.
Also, if there was a plot hole, it would not mean the writers are "not smart". It would just be a mistake. It is something that arises in even the best-written movies and shows, and LOST is basically a 70-hour movie at this point. I commend them for having such a near-flawless and expansive mythology. So we're really nitpicking here. But I like nitpicking, and LOST is a show that invites nitpicking. I want to see them close up the loose ends that they have left by the end of the show and this is one of them.
3D said: So we come back to the same problem: why didn't they just snatch the same three people in "The Hunting Party" instead of releasing them and going through an elaborate scheme to recapture them?
I think the answer may be that they had not thought of the tumor storyline, or even the Ben character at all, at the point of "The Hunting Party".
I tend to agree. Didn't they say Michael Emerson was originally booked for only 6 episodes in Season 2, and his performance was so diabolically great that they extended his character? And he appeared a few episodes after THP.
The whole tumor storyline was flawed as a plotline anyway, and if it was not in the original outline of Lost that could contribute to why it seemed so contrived. As many have said before, if the Others had just approached the crash survivors and helped them instead of kidnapped, tortured and murdered them, the Losties might in turn have been more open to helping them in return.
As far as I'm concerned they still haven't explained the Others' real reason for being on the island, if they are no longer connected with Dharma. I wish they would.
You all seem to forget that in "The Hunting Party" there were:
- Jack, Kate (kidnapped), Michael (kidnapped), Sawyer, Locke
- Tom, Alex, Pickett and maybe two more Others
Maybe that's why they didn't kidnapped JKS.
Exactly, Dragossh,
The Others' set up in "The Hunting Party" was a ruse to keep Locke, Jack and Sawyer from overpowering them. Then didn't have the capacity to kidnap them. And you know that Kate wouldn't let them all give themselves up and over just for her. She'd rather d-i-e.
I don't think they came up with the whole Ben character after Emerson's perfomance. I think that Ben and "Henry" were intended to be different characters.
It´s not a matter of this webisode... but from the first one.
The first webisode was to get us the link between sun family and jack family.
On the first series Lost in translation (117) there is a small talk about jin travelling to USA to deliver gold Watchs to Sun father associates.
Now... the watch that jin has is his or is the one that christian gave jack in his wedding day?
Juliet drives me crazy, please let the writers invent some other expression on her face than that closed lip thing she's got going on.
What if the mobisodes/missing pieces are flash forwards??? its just a random though!
I don't think its the writer's fault that Juliet always has that sneering expression on her face. I think that just comes naturally to Elizabeth Mitchell.
I can't say that I find Elizabeth Mitchell to be a very capable actress. She seldom comes across as believable and don't find her Julia to be very likable. The only scene I liked her in was the one where she asked Jack to help save Colleen and she said to Ben, "Do you want her to die?". That was her best line.
Looks like they are holding Michael in one of the tepees outside the Door Station that Sayid found (notice the round shape of the room, the lattice "supports" to keep the tepee fabric from blowing in and you can see the fire outside when Juliet leaves the room).
So maybe the Others WERE using this as a camp and not just a ruse
AND
perhaps the Door Station is not really a "fake" station.
Thoughts anyone?